The design of the game has now filled an A4 file, and each day I come up with something new. In fact the actual story of the game is huge.

To help program the adventure I have been looking at lots of different text / graphics adventures trying to pick out whats good and bad?

Ive checked out lots of games forum's and though people tend to lend there views to arcade games, adventures don't get much mention.

Id like to get things right first time, and really create a unqiue game. I really would'nt want to sit back after a couple of months when its finished and say 'wish Id put that in or done that different'.

Lots of people can't program but have vast amounts of ideas, this is what this site is about.

So.....What would people like to see in an adventure, what don't you like, was there something done on another machine but not on the Electron or BBC that you though heh! thats good. Importantly how long should it take to complete?

Obviously personal opinions here, but I hate, really hate unmappable mazes, hate 'em !, did I say that enough ! If I ever come across them the entire game ends there for me and is shelved.

Also you have this already but I do like characters moving and interacting with each other a little bit. combination puzzles, such as having to put two objects together to make a new item and then also still have to add something to this to get another useful object.

Clever puzzles, one I once thought was neat was an ice lake of pure water at freezing temperature. Of course absolutely pure still water won't freeze and you'd to drop an icicle (I think) into it and it froze solid letting you cross it. Can't remember what game this was in (perhaps "The Lost Crystal").

Having puzzles like a key for a door is a bit boring.

I'd have to agree with Steve's comments regarding the puzzles. There's nothing more satisfying than figuring out how to complete a puzzle in order to be able to progress in the game and the more complex the puzzle the more satisfying it is. Things like finding a key to unlock a door is a bit boring so should be kept to an absolute minimum.

My favourite text adventure "The Cube of Zoth" had some great puzzles in it. There was a bit in the game where you had two coins, one silver and one gold. At one point there was a child who comes up to you offering something (can't remember what though) and you have to give a coin. First time I played this I gave him the silver coin reasoning that the gold one was more valuable. Later on you have to use a photo booth and trying to use the gold coin doesn't work as it is too big and you needed the silver one!

Steve also mentioned unmappable mazes. These, in my opinion, are fine (but again should be kept to a minimum) as long as there is some clue on how to get out. "The Cube of Zoth" had an unmappable maze where you had to keep listening in order to be able to get yourself out, although I forget the exact details.

A progress indicator e.g. '48% of game complete' would be a good addition too.

Kind regards,

Francis.

Time for me to stick my oar in.

• I think the other guys are a bit hasty dismissing classic puzzles like finding a key. The trick is to make sure you bring your own touch to it, and make the solution less than obvious. For example, in preparation for the upcoming movie sequel, I'm currently working my way through Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis. There's a fantastic bit where your partner Sophia Hapgood pretends to host a seance and convince a guy that she is channelling the spirit of an Atlantean god-king, Nur-Ab-Sal. Whilst this is going on, as Indy, you can turn off the lights, wear a sheet taken from the bed and then turn on a torch to make a ghostly apparition. However, as soon as you step up to the table that the others are sitting out, they simply ask why Indy is making a fool of himself ... it was really funny the first time I played it. So, IMHO, there's nothing wrong with putting a twist on a classic puzzle at all ...
  
  
• I'd suggest trying to read up as much as possible on adventure game design, if you can - see if your local library can order in any of the classic books, like Bob Redrup's The Adventure Gamer's Manual (ISBN: 185058253X) and Peter Killworth's How To Write Adventure Games for the BBC Microcomputer Model B And Acorn Electron (ISBN: 0140078142).
  
  
• Don't make puzzles too hard. They are almost inevitably going to be harder to solve than you initially intend. Several games put ppl off simply because they get stuck so early on (e.g. Scott Adam's Questprobe #1: The Hulk - as a kid, I could never work out how to get out of the initial room). Steve's icicle puzzle for example is going to be absolutely maddening, if you're not from a background with that kind of science knowledge. I'd suggest including some clues along the way, in this case such as a chemistry book describing the properties of frozen water etc.
  
  
• Don't let ppl die or get completely stuck. Having to slog back from a previous save point is very off-putting. Instead of killing someone, send them back to a known location and allow them to retry until they get the solution.
  
  
• I agree with Francis on unmappable mazes - they're OK, provided there is a logical solution. e.g. in The Saga of Erik the Viking, there is a maze with different coloured rooms. Each room has a political colour: if it is red, you move left out of the room; if it is blue, go right; and if it is yellow, move ahead. Note that there has to be a logic to it, and preferably a hint somewhere too ...
  
  
• Progress indicators are traditionally points-based. If you perform an action you earn a set number of points. That's a good model, IMHO, because if you extend the game later, you can refer the X point version and Y point version separately, like with Crowther & Woods' original Adventure and it's descendants.
  
  
• The size/scale of an adventure is best described by the number of commands it takes to complete the game (rather than, say, the number of locations).
  
  
• Finally, don't try and fit everything in. You'd be better off fitting in puzzles that fit with the story rather than trying to use every trick you can think of. You can always use the engine to write another adventure later ... make the story your focal point. If the puzzle doesn't fit, make a note of it and leave it for another adventure.

HTH,

Sam.

Hi Sam,

A lot of good points there.

I don't have a problem with keys in an adventure. What I meant, although it didn't come across as it, is don't have a location where you have the key sitting in plain sight. Something like a locked box where you need to solve some sort of puzzle in order to be able to open it to reveal the key is a lot more satisfying.

Another example comes from my "The Search for the Lost Football" text adventure (all this talk of adventure games really makes me want to try and track this down). At one point in the game you are in a cloakroom with some coats in it. Doing a search of the room reveals that one of the coats has a key in one of the pockets.

Kind regards,

Francis.

Ahh, but I'm saying it is OK to have the keys in plain sight, provided you add a twist!

For example, you might use the key and discover the door is booby-trapped, sending you down a trapdoor. Or that the key is for a different door, later in the game. If you haven't given them any other keys up to that point, then the trick for the player is to realise that the key is a red herring (for this particular door) and that it needs to be opened some other way, like forcing the hinges.

I especially like it when an obvious solution is tried and rebuffed in a humorous manner e.g. "There is a medium-sized spider sat in it's web on the wall nearby. It watches with interest as you rattle the key unsuccessfully in the lock. It glances over at you, and it's expression appears to be silently mocking you for seriously thinking that it would be as simple as that. After a few more moments of staring, it appears to snort in contempt and mutters something scornful about your adventuring qualifications under it's breath before scuttling away.".

Using classic puzzle scenarios is a good way of settling the player in and can help to get them comfortable with the game, before you chuck the hardest stuff at them!

I don't think it can be stressed enough that it's vitally important that the earliest moves draw the player into the story, and provide them with some early successes so they are hooked enough to persevere when things get tougher ...

Sam.

Hi Sam,

Ah, now I understand what you meant.

I like your example with the spider by the way!

Kind regards,

Francis

Thanks.

The trick is to add enough text to make the game interesting and a good read/laugh but being careful to avoid confusing the player with too much information. In this case, the spider is made to leave so the player doesn't spend hours trying to pick him up (as he's not really meant to be an object in the game).

In fact, I quite like the idea of making him a recurring character, every time you reach a seemingly obvious puzzle ...

Sam.

Thanks for the feedback. Keep the up the suggestions.

I’ve been trying to do things that haven’t been done before, not to be clever just different. When you consider how many adventure games were written, to come up with something original to keep people interested is quite hard. This is the reason that so much work is been put into the main engine of the game, the things in so far such as changing weather patterns and learnable alphabet mean you can devise totally different kinds of puzzles to what was written years ago.

There will be doors with locks in the game, but not all locks need keys! There is a maze, it might seem impossible at first, but there is a way to map it which is both easy and logical.

The game is going to be big, but is broke down into different chapters with different scenarios and locations. This I hope will give the impression of the player not involved in one single quest, but more of a life’s adventure for the character. All of the chapters though different will be connected to the final outcome, thus the final score, but there are sub plots to be found which also count towards your score, but don’t generally have to be completed to progress. So in the end you could complete the game but not have the top score.

Again as I said thanks and keep your ideas coming, it would be nice to get some input from people apart from the normal contributors.

this looks flippin ace PaulD

makes the adventure Stranded look awfull!

i prefer graphics top, text bottom, not like other adventures (TKValley, ErikTheViking) that show a little pic,
press space and then get some text

Good luck on it all working out

CM

Just a few things that are now in or out.

In.

The pictures are shown separate to the text, in the Twin Kingdom Valley style, though a lot more detailed as there scanned in then converted to Mode 1 screens. There is a command to turn pictures on / off.

Real time, things happen at certain times on a real-time clock, it gets colder at night the sun is highest at midday. Shops also open and close, at certain times. There is a command 'Time' that displays the time also. This play an important part in some puzzles.

Out.

Sound and speech, I just couldn't get it to feel right. I tried to use speech when you asked characters questions but it just did not work. Also sound just didn't feel corrects I tried to have things like clock's chiming and water running but just couldn't get the desired sound.

In but not as planned.

The learnable alphabet is still there but has been changed slightly in the way that you learn it. I might go back to my old way, but it was getting a bit hard to do.

Does the clock run at human time ? or a bit speeded up, i.e. so 24 hours in the game isn't 24 in real life.

Sounding really good this Paul

I assume time is being done either in a speeded up time (playing the game for over a day sounds painful!) or on a per-move basis - so every move takes 10 minutes, say.

Either way, rather than having to type TIME, I'd prefer to have a permanent display, perhaps on a status bar - this saves me repeatedly asking what the current time it is, and also is a permanent reminder that time is a factor in the game.

The status bar could also include how many points have been scored so far and how many moves have been made too.

My 2p's worth,

Sam.

Amazing that sound is included - was there ever an adventure that had it for the BBC/Elk?
Didn't some C64 adventures have music - how much memory would that have eaten up?

There was a version of the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (not the Infocom one) that had sound effects throughout the game. The only one that comes to mind however is when Marvin the android came into the scene you had the sound effect of him walking.

Kind regards,

Francis.

Was that for the C64 or Beeb?

The only hitch-hiker's games I know are the Infocom one, an unofficial BASIC affair for the Beeb called Hitchhiker (Computer Concepts?) and Starship Titanic.

I can't find a mention of another one on Lemon64 ...

Sam.

That was for the BBC. I can't remember who done it, but it's title was, I'm sure, the full 'The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy'. It also played the main theme tune at the start of the game.

Kind regards,

Francis.

That's definitely not Hitch-Hiker ... and I can't find any others at STH.

Must be AWOL.

Sam.